This one is really quite fascinating...

Discussion in 'PHYSICS & MATHEMATICS' started by Javadog, Dec 6, 2012.

  1. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    ...taken from someone's .sig on the other site:
    [​IMG]

    At first you leap to %25 because there is a one in four chance of guessing right.

    ...but there are two %25's

    ...so the answer must be %50

    ....but then there is only one %50

    ...so the answer must be %25

    ...so...ugh

    :0)
     
  2. tazzman

    tazzman Hobby Grower Mushroom Doctor

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    Dosen't mater what the answers are Could be

    A. %1
    B.%uitkop
    C. %1 = 94k
    D.% Shiitake

    At random 1 in 4 or %25
     
  3. Jeff

    Jeff Well-Known Member Moderator Mushroom Doctor Supporter

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    You have a 2 in 4 chance....
     
  4. tazzman

    tazzman Hobby Grower Mushroom Doctor

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    only if you pick a or d
     
  5. tazzman

    tazzman Hobby Grower Mushroom Doctor

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    if %25 is wrong you have a 1 in 3
    if %25 is right you could pick a right answer 2 times and a wrong answer 2 times so 1/1 % 50

    so at random you have a 1 in 3
     
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  6. Jeff

    Jeff Well-Known Member Moderator Mushroom Doctor Supporter

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    What is correct? ugh
     
  7. tazzman

    tazzman Hobby Grower Mushroom Doctor

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    Ok ok you can be worng twice and right twice
    and if you pic E. you I gotta got to bed
     
  8. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    I am going with %25.

    Honestly it is weird as %25 suggests that the real answer is %50
    where %50 suggests that the real answer is %25.

    Ahhhh....feel the burn. Mmmmmm.

    JD
     
  9. Jeff

    Jeff Well-Known Member Moderator Mushroom Doctor Supporter

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    I am going to recant my original answer. The question does not imply your chances of picking the same percentage, it asks what are your chances of picking the "right" one. There is no way of calculating the correct answer because the question is not phrased to lead you to a percentage.
    My brain hurts.
     
  10. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    Mine too!

    This reminds me of the funny answer to what will happen
    if you tie a piece of buttered toast to a cat, butter side up,
    and then drop them. What side will hit the ground.

    We all know that a cat always lands on its feet....but we
    also know that the butter side of a dropped piece of toast
    always hits the ground.

    Well, some dude reasoned that they would fall to just above
    the ground, then then they would levitate, spinning back
    and forth.

    ...he went on to propose that this could be used to lift
    trains....that huge "buttered toast/cat arrays" would
    replace mag-lev trains.

    I am still spinning.

    JD
     
  11. rogue

    rogue ♥ Hooked on Mycelium ♥ Moderator Mushroom Doctor Supporter

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    :iagree:

    three different answers/possibilities
     
  12. Terry M

    Terry M Member Mushroom Doctor

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    I just saw this thread this morning. I'm having a great time thinking about it! I don't know the answer yet, or even the right way to think about the problem so as to get THE answer. But it should provided hours of challenging enjoyment for me today!! Thanks JD!
    :wow:
     
  13. rogue

    rogue ♥ Hooked on Mycelium ♥ Moderator Mushroom Doctor Supporter

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    :grrr:, now I'm looking at it differently.
     
  14. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    It is a good one isn't it?!?!

    It does cause the ole' pain between the ears.....ah, the good pain.

    I have a few others, of my own (inc. one from the Math GRE that I love),
    that cause a similar itch, but this one is in a class of its own.

    :lol:

    JD
     
  15. Terry M

    Terry M Member Mushroom Doctor

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    I just got the answer! But I've got a massage scheduled for noon (I know, it's a tough life!), and this requires a bit of explanation and also a simpler problem/example to understand it better.

    So later today ...
     
  16. Terry M

    Terry M Member Mushroom Doctor

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    If both 25% answers (A and D) are true, then 50% (B) is true. But if B is true, then neither A or D can be true.
    The answer is that there is no answer. And this is not a cop-out. It's an example one of a vast number of mathematical paradoxes which have no solution.

    Here's another, somewhat simpler one. It has no numbers, only logic.

    A card has the following printed on both sides:
    Side A) The sentence on the other side of this card is TRUE.
    Side B) The sentence on the other side of this card is FALSE.

    Try assigning truth values to each side, and you'll see that there's no way to do it.

    So how can mathematics allow paradoxes to exist? Isn't math supposed the explain everything about numbers and logic?

    Why these paradoxes exist wasn't understood until an incredible brilliant guy named Kurt Gödel proved something called the incompleteness theorem. The essence of it is that all logic proofs cannot be defined by logic. And that there is a mathematics for showing this!!

    BTW, Gödel's incompleteness theorem proof is complicated, and involves assigning integer numbers to absolutely everything in a mathematical statement. It always makes my head spin when I try to understand it. :outhair:
     
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  17. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    OK....cool....so I was right in seeing no answer. :lol:

    I think that Godel kinda went nuts too.

    What was really depressing was reading where Hamilton
    (I think that's who it was) was trying to form a system of
    equations from which all other mathematics could be derived.

    ...he was forced to abandon the task when Godel proved
    that what he was trying to do was impossible.

    Hamilton was hardly a dry well though.

    Good stuff!

    JD
     
  18. Professor PinHead

    Professor PinHead Lost in the Tek.... Administrator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor Supporter

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  19. Javadog

    Javadog Moderator Moderator Mushroom Doctor Cannabis Doctor

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    All we need is Bach to complete the golden braid. :0)

    I watched the scene from the film "Inception" (LOVE IT) the other
    day where they depict an Escher situation very well.

    Take care,

    JD
     
  20. Terry M

    Terry M Member Mushroom Doctor

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    I love this one, because it combines complementary visual and auditory illusions:

     
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