Dumb "dunk and roll" question

Discussion in 'MUSHROOM CULTIVATION' started by Toothless026, May 1, 2019.

  1. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    This might be a dumb question but I still have to ask... I birthed my cakes a few days ago, at the time I didn't have any vermiculite left, so I dunked but didn't roll. My question is, is it too late to do it now? They are not pinning yet. Can I give them a quick dunk and a roll now, or would I only damage them?
     
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  2. Mainframe

    Mainframe Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure they will produce well without the verm, as it helps retain moisture. But you run the risk of trapping contaminates that may have since landed/ended up on your cakes. That is the reason you don't do a dunk and roll after 1st flush. More experienced members should chime in soon.
     
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  3. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    Thank you. Im not too worried about moisture actually. I've been able to maintain 98-99% humidity. I was told to dunk and roll them now bc there was actually an incident involving a stray ball, a dog, and the sgfc. There is some mild bruising and small tears in the mycelium as a result. I guess their line of thinking was rolling them now would somehow fortify the cakes to prevent further damage. However my concern is further damage caused by the rolling itself. But maybe im off track completely in even considering to dunk and roll them now, if moisture isn't the concern...? It's my first grow in case it's not blatantly obvious. Haha​
     
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  4. Mainframe

    Mainframe Well-Known Member

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    It's all good I'm on my 3rd and really not much success. But the longer you lurk here the more knowledge you'll gain. Mild bruising shouldn't matter. If your humidity is there I'd say just leave them be. Posting pics is helpful too if possible.
     
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  5. n0j0y

    n0j0y Well-Known Member

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    I view the other way around, granted I haven't done a cake in a while. The idea in my head is a fully colonized cake/tub is able to fight other contams well. After you rip it up harvesting there are a lot of exposed bits that may be less colonized than the outter layers so you run higher risk of contam. Same would be true after lots of activity or getting knocked around.

    From my view the roll doesn't fortify much, at least when I did it it was sparse the way it stuck. It didn't form like an impenetrable wall. If moisture is good and you mist and stuff my thought is to skip the roll, but those more versed with pf Tek might chime in otherwise.


    Other option is to try both. This is a learning hobby and it'll let you see the difference between the two if you have multiple cakes. I know the first grow is nerve racking and you just want success so that option is a bit tricky to jump on.
     
  6. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    I appreciate the input. Unfortunately I am down to my last cake. :( So I think I'll leave it be. I don't think it looks too dry but it is my first time, so if anyone notices otherwise, please feel free to let me know. I'm attempting to post pictures so bear with me. Haha
     
  7. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    These pictures were taken after the cake was picked up but before it was placed into the new sgfc. It's the same cake just from different angles. Sorry for the crappy pictures.
     

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  8. n0j0y

    n0j0y Well-Known Member

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    Looks ok by my eye. What size jar was that?
     
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  9. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    1/2 pint
     
  10. n0j0y

    n0j0y Well-Known Member

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    Ah is that a regular mouth? Was looking mighty tall. Was just curious.

    Good luck with it!
     
  11. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    I think it only looks that way in the picture bc of the awkward angle I was at. This is one of my empty jars.
     

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  12. Mainframe

    Mainframe Well-Known Member

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    Looks pretty good to me too. Deep breath:awegrow: if at first we don't succeed try try try again. But I wouldn't be surprised if you get some fruit.
     
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  13. n0j0y

    n0j0y Well-Known Member

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    I'm just used to wide mouth jars. Much more squat. Some say they consolidate faster and easier to birth cakes.
     
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  14. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    I really hope I get some fruit!!! I don't care how little. Any would be awesome. I inoculated 12 jars. Didn't lose any to contam untill after this jar was almost fully colonized. None of the other ones started to grow anything at all untill I started cracking open lids to figure out what the deal was. I will never again buy my jars pre-filled. That was mistake number 1. They were so densely packed I don't think there was any room for anything to grow.

    I heard that about the wide mouth jars. But not untill after I'd been waiting a month for a hint of mycelium growth. Lol I've been really thinking about trying those next time. I inoculated this cake back on March 9. I knew it was going to take awhile but wow. I am a very impatient person so this has been a major test for me. Haha
     
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  15. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    Please ignore my hygrometer. The pictures were taken right after fanning. But they were taken before misting, so obviously it's not that dry in there. haha This is my new setup. Any tweaks or ideas for improvement?
     

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  16. kdmmontana

    kdmmontana Well-Known Member

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    1. Never buy "Ready made" substrates (or anything at all "ready made") These things are scams in most cases.

    Your cake will fruit just fine under the conditions you have, you can Think like this: If I spray down one cake with water, then that means that its surroundings are about 100 % moisture.
    You want to keep the cakes moist, NOT SOGGY or drowning. If you Think of it like that then you will notice how badly your substrate would fruit had you kept it constantly Awash with water.
    There is more than enough water in the mycelial network after the dunk and roll for the cake to fruit. We use Vermiculite barriers because it keeps the top part of your cake about 90 % soaked with all the water it will need. Most new users either drown their substrates or keep the area too warm. Never use fans, never use heating pads or mats (unless its unusually Cold) 24 C is more than enough temperature for your cakes. The Vermiculite layer we "case" with is there because Verm holds a lot of water and will keep the Surface moist. Id say you wouldnt even need to spray your cake more than once a day if youve got Everything set up.

    2. Just leave it as is, keep it moist and it will fruit without a sweat:)

    /KD
     
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  17. kdmmontana

    kdmmontana Well-Known Member

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    No improvement needed, I dont even use perlite in my grows and it all goes well:) Welcome to Myco-Tek. Of course you should aim for a proper SGFC so leave that perlite where it is.

    You dont need a glass of water standing in there, but then again it depends on why its there.
     
  18. kdmmontana

    kdmmontana Well-Known Member

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    Here are one of my cakes:)

    5970-1351010044-a0639ac381417dd8dcbbbb0532f3849b.jpg

    Neato setup good luck and again: Welcome!
     
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  19. Toothless026

    Toothless026 New Member

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    On another group I'm apart of they all said to get rid of the airstone and water jar, so I have. I was using it to help keep the humidity up but I guess it's really not necessary. I haven't had trouble keeping the cake moist since removing it. It's been in the fruiting chamber for 2 weeks as of today. I really hope I start to see some pins soon.
     
  20. n0j0y

    n0j0y Well-Known Member

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    in my experience, they come about 2 days after you give up hope of them pinning
     
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